A Discussion on Yielding

[Andrew]

From my post no. 210 in this thread .......

..... we have seen nothing to substantiate any of the claims you have made and continue to make. Does this make you "a cut above the rest" in this respect?

Oh --- still waiting for answers to my questions which have been repeated in posts 160, 167, 192 and 199 of this thread. If you are not going to answer these basic and fundamental questions, then please let me know.

As I said then, if you are not going to substantiate any of your claims to make you appear "a cut above the rest" (as you put it) nor answer my questions which are absolutely fundamental to this thread, then please let us know. Just ignoring my questions is giving off certain signals to the other readers which are, as far as I can tell:
- Your claims, which I have questioned, were false claims with no substance and no reasoning but to argue for argument's sake
or
- Your claims, which I have questioned, are indeed valid in your context but you cannot explain them
or
- You prefer to hack around on a minor point (Anthony's video) to distract attention from your lack of response to my questions

By the way, I also don't believe Anthony can repeat the exactly what was shown in the photo series because his legs are shorter and he has a bald head which means he would have to grow a few inches and add some hair to his head otherwise it wouldn't be identical. Oh ... and move to England too .

And Subclock's post is excellent by the way.

The pictures are to me a breakdown of the technique into many parts ( which is very good for understanding underlying principles and strategies ) . While the video is the Streamlined application .

The picture sequence is what I would expect to learn first as a beginner if I was struggling to grasp the movements in their streamlined form . Then as my understanding grows I would make my Kung Fu come Alive .

And as I mentioned before. I have been on the receiving end of this technique from my Sihing --- and it all took considerably less than 1 second. Excellent timing, spacing and judgement that was!

Andrew

[Sifu Stier]

WahnamCH:

I didn't ignore your questions. I already told you that I don't intend to engage your questions and why in Post #19 of the 'Tactics and Strategies' thread. I haven't changed my mind. I guess you were so preoccupied with planning your next verbal assault that you missed my response, eh? I know this must be a great disappointment to you, a stellar opportunity missed and all, but you'll get over it eventually.

You don't need or want any answers to your questions from me anyway. You have your Sifu to consult with on these matters. And besides, that wasn't the reason for asking them anyway, was it? Ditto for the video requests, right? So, you'll have to do without. Sorry!

Doc

[Michael Udel]

simultaneous typing

I just wanted to add when I started posting Michael Udel's and Sifu Stier's latest posts were not there yet . I didn't ignore you guys on purpose .

Yeah, this has happened to me, too. There I am typing away, perhaps asking a question, only to find that it was answered by someone while I was typing, and now my post makes me look like the kid in class who asks about what the teacher just finished explaining . I have learned to look at the recent posts shown when I preview my current post, which lets me know of any new ones before submitting my current article. -Michael

PS-I have been confounded as to express myself with emoticons and just realized that if I hold my mouse over them I actually get told what they're supposed to mean. And all this time I was afraid of being misunderstood

[Andrew]

WahnamCH:

I didn't ignore your questions. I already told you that I don't intend to engage your questions and why in Post #19 of the 'Tactics and Strategies' thread. I haven't changed my mind. I guess you were so preoccupied with planning your next verbal assault that you missed my response, eh? I know this must be a great disappointment to you, a stellar opportunity missed and all, but you'll get over it eventually.

You don't need or want any answers to your questions from me anyway. You have your Sifu to consult with on these matters. And besides, that wasn't the reason for asking them anyway, was it? Ditto for the video requests, right? So, you'll have to do without. Sorry!

Doc

And you say the other forum members are predictable . I will leave the other forum members to draw their own conclusions from this.

Maybe someone else will ask my basic questions which you have refused to respond to. Anyone care to guess Sifu Stier's reaction?

Andrew

By the way, Sifu Stier, it would make it much easier for the others here to know who you are refering to if you could be consistent in your use of names. You have called me Andrew, Sifu Barnett, Sifu Andrew, WahnamCH and even Sifu Andy --- I wonder what new name you will come up with next

[Andrew]

To save people searching, here is Sifu Stier's post #19 on the Strategies and Tactics thread which was posted 2 days after I asked my questions in this thread in post 160.

Andrew

[Marcus]

Quote by Sifu Stier

“I thought you guys knew that one of the privileges of being a Sifu is the peer group privilege of addressing other Sifu's on a first name basis after establishing some association with one another, leaving the formalities for those of lesser rank to employ.”

Dear Sifu Stier or Gary, (which one you would prefer me to address you?)

Whilst you continue to split hairs, I would like to remind everyone that the PUSH sequence I posted was in response to a post originally made by Sifu Stier:

'If they choose to charge forward...let them do so, and pull them face first into the wall or some other unmoving, solid object.

Nothing Sifu Stier has posted has changed my view that the sequence I posted is an improvement over the one he originally posted. In fact I wonder if he has actually tried it? Even our beginning students can apply the technique in 3 seconds.

In post 195 I wrote:

I only have 3 or 4 more pictorial sequences to post based on the material covered in this thread so far. As a token of my continued respect for Sifu Stier, I will not use his name in any of these posts.

I wrote this because I was interested to see how Sifu Stier would respond to this token. Alas it was predictable, he has become bolder in his condescending and insulting manner towards Anthony. E.g.

I'd probably be willing to let you off the hook on this video issue, except for the fact you were so quick to jump all over my assessment of the actions depicted in the still photo sequence with your condescendingly smug claim

or Sifu Stiers post 198 where he considers Anthony's excellent post on Wisdom and Courage

an excellent attempt at re-direction

I will be taking a lot of photographs at tonights London class and will continue posting sequences for the rest of the week. I can't wait to get started on yielding and it's application against Kicks, Throws and Grips.

Kind regards

Marcus

Namo Amitabha Buddha Namo Amitabha Buddha Namo Amitabha Buddha

[Antonius]

Why do I do it?

Dear Michael,

I understand your point in your last post. I do. I've met many masters (and so-called masters) from many different countries, and I know what you're talking about. But I'm sticking to my approach in handling Sifu Stier. Why? Well, I think that's a question for another thread, which you can find here: Unexpected Lessons

Best,

[Michael Udel]

Thanks

Thank you, Sifu Anthony for giving consideration to my words. I am writing a post in another thread after just learning of that thread and finding things amiss. The tone of that post is different than my last to you, but please do not confuse them. They are different matters, IMHO.

Best wishes,
Michael

[Adam B]

And so, as much as I am tempted to field all of your questions, I'm left feeling that the effort required to do so is probably more than I care to make. And besides, you'd only find fault with my answers anyway, right?

Sifu Stier,

I understand the feeling of futility at having your answers challenged, and I was wondering how it is different from the fault you find in the videos/comments of the Wahnam instructors regardless of what they post?

Would it be possible for you to post some videos to show how you would counter this attack? (Not necessairily the push/pull technique you described much earlier, but anything demonstrating the use of yielding at a master's level)

I truly hope so, because as a long time lurker, I've been very excited about seeing some Shen Men Tao in action.

Adam

[Mark Blohm]

Dear Sifu Stier,

Thank you for your response to my last post. I share Adam's eagerness to see Shen Men Tao in action, especially on the topic of yielding. Will you show us a video?

Respectfully,

Mark

[Andrew]

And whilst the whole discussion on the other threads is going on about how to protect Sifu Stier from those horrible Shaolin Wahnam instructors , maybe Sifu Stier will find time to address the issues on this thread ?

Andrew

[Sifu Stier]

Sifu Barnett:

I am not obligated to respond to anyone or anything on this forum, just like everyone else. If and when I do respond by submitting a post, it is because I choose to do so. Understood?

Thank you.

[Maxime]

I am learning a lot. Thanks to everybody.

I think my seniors are tolerant. I think it is legitimate for us to ask Sifu Stier some proof about his claims. It is in no way out of disrespect. How can I admit that I do not agree blindly with my seniors on faith alone (i.e simply because they are my seniors), and at the same time accept blindly what others are saying, without bringing proof to their claims? I think Sifu Stier should feel honoured, because it proves Shaolin Wahnam values his contributions with intelligence and perspicacity. It is better to have a talk with high moral and 'caring for the art' persons than with careless and blind people, who put shame to martial arts.

I think my seniors are courageous. When we study the past 20 years martial history, we find many bogus teachers claiming things they cannot do (I am not talking about Sifu Stier here). I am always schocked, even now, when I see those so-called 'experts' with whom you can never try a friendly sparring match, nor you see free sparring (not pre-arranged sparring), etc... Most of what is seen today is pre-arranged in all circunstamces and allows the 'teacher' to appear under a 'right angle'. A beautiful Shaw Brothers movie (I like them...as entertainment).

In this regard, my seniors are especially courageous because, like Sifu, they do not hesitate to share freely unedited video material. They are not afraid of criticism, laughing or threats. For example, as many people don't understand why many Wahnam videos are showing sparring with standard speed (not combat speed) - because in my opinion those people are lacking combat methodology knowledge -, our seniors continue to explain tirelessly the principles behind those videos for the benefits of those who will be able to grasp the essence. This is to be respected.

I have no doubt that Sifu Stier is an excellent fighter and a knowledgeable master. It is of course legitimate for him to answer a post when he feels so. Nobody in Wahnam (I speak from the heart here, please my seniors forgive my directness and maybe 'overstepping' ), I think, will ever exerce force on anyone to get an answer. Nevertheless, realizing the openess and the efforts made by my seniors to preserve and spread the beauty of the Chinese Martial Arts (and I am sure that those Arts are close to Sifu Stier's heart), it would be fair from him to provide some videos, or at least a couple of pictures, to definitively 'put his money where his mouth is', so to speak

This is only an humble and respectful wish, not an order of course

I think also that many misconceptions arise from mistaking words. For example, people sometimes mistake compassion for accepting everything. Some mistake courage with aggressivity, others sincerity with rudeness. Of course, it is sometimes a matter of perspective and semantics when it comes to a discussion forum. But, anyway, with as little emotions as possible, we can all react accordingly with precision, compassion, hardness and softness all in one!

Best regards to everybody,

Maxime

[Adam B]

Understood?

I am not obligated to respond to anyone or anything on this forum, just like everyone else. If and when I do respond by submitting a post, it is because I choose to do so. Understood?

Are we to "understand" this to mean you aren't going to post a video?

[Sifu Stier]

Adam:

I don't sell books and videos, or Shen Men Tao caps and coffee mugs, etc., so I don't Have a video to post. The materials I do have are distributed to my own students and close associates, but never to detractors and adversaries, such as most of the folks who demand to see such things here.

Please understand that this is nothing personal against you. So...at such time as I do offer such things, I'll send you one if you wish to e-mail me your snail mail address. Fair enough?

Sifu Stier